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Apple Removes Civil War Games From App Store Over Confederate Flag Usage

5 years 10 months ago #1 by chijohnaok

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  • www.macrumors.com/2015/06/25/apple-removes-civil-war-games-confederate-flag/

    Apple Removes Civil War Games From App Store Over Confederate Flag Usage


    Thursday June 25, 2015 6:43 am PDT by Joe Rossignol

    Apple has removed seemingly all Civil War games from the App Store for displaying the Confederate Flag in "offensive and mean-spirited ways," our sister website TouchArcade has learned. Apple has sent a removal letter to affected developers to inform them that their app does not comply with Section 19.1 of the App Store Review Guidelines.

    "19.1 Apps containing references or commentary about a religious, cultural or ethnic group that are defamatory, offensive, mean-spirited or likely to expose the targeted group to harm or violence will be rejected."
    MacRumors did a spot check of the App Store and can confirm that Apple has removed dozens of Civil War games depicting the Confederate Flag, which has been at the center of a racial controversy ignited by a Charleston, South Carolina church shooting last week. Most educational or generic Civil War apps remain available on the App Store.

    A sampling of the Civil War games removed from the App Store:

    Ultimate General: Gettysburg
    AAA American Civil War Cannon Shooter
    Civil War: Hidden Mysteries
    Civil War The Battle Game
    Civil War Defense
    Civil War Battle Defense
    1861 A Civil War Rebellion
    Civil War: 1862
    Civil War: 1863

    Apple did not immediately respond to request for comment.


    I wonder what impact this move by Apple may have on Scourge of War: Gettysburg?
    There may not be a SOW:G app on Apple, but as we have seen from the recent decisions by many retailers (Walmart, Amazon, e-Bay) to pull items for sale that contain the Confederate flag, is it simply a matter of time before that ripples into computer games like SOW:G?
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    5 years 10 months ago #2 by norb-1

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  • Civil War Defense and Civil War Battle Defense were written by NorbSoftDev. Our facebook page has the letter we received. www.facebook.com/sowgb

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    "Leave these men alone! Let them go! For if their purpose or activity is of human origin, it will fail. But if it is from God, you will not be able to stop these men; you will only find yourselves fighting against God.” - Gamaliel 40 A.D.
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    5 years 10 months ago #3 by the reb

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  • Play acting is not allowed? People get real....
    the reb....
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    5 years 10 months ago #4 by Saddletank

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  • "We are writing to notify you that your app has been removed from the App Store because it includes images of the confederate flag used in offensive and mean-spirited ways."

    Um. I just don't get this. It's not being used "in offensive and mean-spirited ways" it's being used to depict a video game of a historical event.

    What of the thousands of Confederate re-enactors active all over the USA? No rebel flag allowed, or what?

    This is madness. If the flag is used in a commemorative or educational or historical context it's clearly not racist.

    Some people need to either grow up or grow thicker skins.

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    5 years 10 months ago #5 by Bloody Bill

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    5 years 10 months ago #6 by Saddletank

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  • Don't want to wander off into politics but these people are not liberals they are simply stupid.

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    5 years 10 months ago #7 by Gunfreak

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  • I'm a liberal, and i think most people should be able too see the diffrence between flying a flag on government grounds and having it in a game or using it during reenactment.
    Nothing can be left good judgment...

    Again all sides going to the extreme wather its extreme left or right.

    To bad there is no center in America.


    Sorry for the politics.
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    5 years 10 months ago - 5 years 10 months ago #8 by chijohnaok

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  • It is sad that it has come to this.

    Political correctness run amuck.

    I understand that NorbSoftDev may be forced into making decisions in the future as a results of Apple's decision (and this issue in general). I appreciate the authenticity that the game developers have incorporated into making Scourge of War:Gettysburg a superior product.

    I hope that they do not cave under any pressure to alter their product, but I will understand if that does happen and will continue to be a consumer of their product.
    Last edit: 5 years 10 months ago by chijohnaok.
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    5 years 10 months ago #9 by Wales

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  • Defiantly a shame ..... Will happily boycott Apple app store
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    5 years 10 months ago - 5 years 10 months ago #10 by RebBugler

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  • If I may reiterate, my post from Norb's original:

    Thank goodness we didn't spend a year to port over SOW to the Mac format...this would have been disastrous.

    One racist punk has done more harm to our Southern Heritage than all the racist, white supremest organizations have done for decades by using our battle flag as a symbol of their HATE.


    Furthermore, from the language of this thread it appears Europeans have a better grasp of 'politics as normal' in the United States than Americans do.

    It's tough to be a moderate here in the USA, as mentioned earlier in this thread, both our ONLY political parties have swung to the extreme right and left respectively, leaving moderates with no representation, and basically helpless to improve our society, way of life and our world image.

    But we can: Boycott Apple :evil:

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    Last edit: 5 years 10 months ago by RebBugler.
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    5 years 10 months ago #11 by Bloody Bill

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  • Sorry fellas for the Political comment. Just pissed at the stupidity level of my country. I as well will boycott all apple products. I do apologize for bringing the political crap to the forums.
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    5 years 10 months ago #12 by HoldTheLine

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  • If I may reiterate, my post from Norb's original:

    Thank goodness we didn't spend a year to port over SOW to the Mac format...this would have been disastrous.


    Only in that you would not be able to sell the game on Apple's "App Store" - no great loss in my opinion. You could still sell a Mac version via your own web store, matrix, slitherine, steam, whatever.

    Apple have displayed similar behavior to this ban in the past, WW2 wargames have been rejected from the app store because they depict the germans - thereby promoting race hatred in some form of twisted logic.

    So I wonder if Apple have removed any civil war history ebooks from their book store which have the confederate flag illustrated anywhere?

    In Apple's politically correct alternate universe if we all cover our eyes, erase historic symbols from previous conflicts, plug our ears and shout "la la la" there will be no more wars. Then we can all sit down and sing Kumbaya warmed by the glow of our iDevices.
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    5 years 10 months ago #13 by IronBMike

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  • Sorry fellas for the Political comment. Just pissed at the stupidity level of my country. I as well will boycott all apple products. I do apologize for bringing the political crap to the forums.


    No problem man, I'm on your side, don't apologize to anyone. This stuff is infuriating and insane. This country is headed to dark dark places.

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    5 years 10 months ago - 5 years 10 months ago #14 by FLGibsonJr

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  • It appears that this mob mentality is moving to other areas, now there is even discussion about taking down the Jefferson Memorial. I wouldn't doubt the Washington Monument or places named after Jefferson and Washington are next.

    www.latimes.com/entertainment/arts/culture/la-et-cm-thomas-jefferson-confederate-statues-20150624-story.html
    Last edit: 5 years 10 months ago by FLGibsonJr.
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    5 years 10 months ago #15 by privatewilley

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  • This is beyond insane! One of the reason's I own an iphone/ ipad is to play Civil War games and now that is ruined. I don't blame NSD or any other dev's for not wanting to write sanitized games for Apple. Welcome to Amerika!
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    5 years 10 months ago #16 by IronBMike

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  • It appears that this mob mentality is moving to other areas, now there is even discussion about taking down the Jefferson Memorial. I wouldn't doubt the Washington Monument or places named after Jefferson and Washington are next.

    www.latimes.com/entertainment/arts/culture/la-et-cm-thomas-jefferson-confederate-statues-20150624-story.html


    IIRC the woman who created the American flag owned slaves. And the US flag has presided over all kinds of "politically incorrect" moments in history...better remove it! Also, better remove all Confederate monuments on battlefields!

    They are already striking on college campuses: www.businessinsider.com/confederate-statues-defaced-at-ut-austin-2015-6

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    5 years 10 months ago #17 by Jubal Early

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  • What a lot of @ :evil: Political correctness gone crazy. I am proud of the link Northern Ireland/Ulster has to the Confederacy its leaders and troops ,one of the reasons my Tag is Jubal Early is because his roots were in Ulster also Stonewall Jackson and Jeb Stuart among others.

    www.ulster-scots.com/uploads/ConfederateGenerals.pdf

    I actually have a Confederate flag perhaps I will be raided by the police :S The South was invaded by the North people seem to forget that, flying the flag does not mean you are a member of the KKK. Don't give in to the tide of Liberalism that's sweeping the western world fly the flag with pride.
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    5 years 10 months ago #18 by Saddletank

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  • Might one of the admins please move this thread to the off-topic area? Its an important debate and its good that different views are made known but it doesn't belong in this section of the forum.

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    5 years 10 months ago #19 by IronBMike

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  • What a lot of @ :evil: Political correctness gone crazy. I am proud of the link Northern Ireland/Ulster has to the Confederacy its leaders and troops ,one of the reasons my Tag is Jubal Early is because his roots were in Ulster also Stonewall Jackson and Jeb Stuart among others.

    www.ulster-scots.com/uploads/ConfederateGenerals.pdf

    I actually have a Confederate flag perhaps I will be raided by the police :S The South was invaded by the North people seem to forget that, flying the flag does not mean you are a member of the KKK. Don't give in to the tide of Liberalism that's sweeping the western world fly the flag with pride.


    Hear hear!

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    5 years 10 months ago #20 by chijohnaok

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  • Might one of the admins please move this thread to the off-topic area? Its an important debate and its good that different views are made known but it doesn't belong in this section of the forum.


    As the creator of this thread, I have no objections to it being moved to the "off topic" area.
    (Not that my approval is required or anything....Just saying that it's fine by me)

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    5 years 10 months ago #21 by Anthropoid

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  • I encourage all of you to contact the firms listed in the abc story.

    It might take an hour to cut-and-paste the draft letter included and post it to all the retailers (linked below) . . . more if you feel you need to remove portions. Time well-spent I think.

    It is only when they receive several hundred (or ideally thousands) of complaints and perceive a risk of lost revenue that they will reconsider.

    Walmart
    corporate.walmart.com/contact-us/store-corporate-feedback

    Amazon.com Inc.

    www.amazon.com/gp/help/contact-us/general-questions.html?skip=true

    Sears Holdings.

    www.searsholdings.com/about/loc.htm

    EBay

    www.ebayinc.com/contact_us

    Etsy

    www.etsy.com/help/contact

    Target

    help.target.com/help/ContactUs

    Spencer Gifts

    www.spencersonline.com/content.jsp?pageName=Contact


    Revised letter

    Dear Sir or Madam,

    I am writing to you in reference to a news article posted at:

    abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory/retailers-banned-sales-confederate-flag-31976447

    entitled "Retailers That Have Banned Sales of the Confederate Flag."

    According to this article you are among a list of retailers who have announced that you will no longer sell the flag(s) of the Confederate States of America, nor items which bear imagery of such flags (hereinafter referred to as CSA Flag(s)).

    First let me say that, I despise the Confederate States of America (CSA).
    I regard the CSA as one of the most evil nations to have existed in the last 1000 years. Evil regimes like Nazi Germany brought fire and destruction to the world and provoked a World War that killed 70 to 80 million. The CSA was not nearly so successful, but the goals of that regime were not much different. Nazi Germany movement sought to eliminate all Jews and various other minority and subject peoples for various ideological and rapacious motivations; the end result was to have been a continent ruled by Nazis, populated by Nazis and devoid of anyone else in perpetuity. The CSA in contrast, had a vision of extending the odd racial "labor camp" model of the American south to as much of the Western hemisphere as they could manage. In this hate-based Empire, an entire category of people would have not simply been eradicated from the landscape, but kept in perpetual servitude and denied basic human rights and legal freedoms and protections. Had the CSA not been soundly defeated by the Union, its leaders may well have succeeded in their horrific vision. The CSA was an evil regime and everyone one of us alive today should be thankful that it was defeated and eliminated.

    It is perhaps a matter of debate whether a devout Nazi was more or less exorable than was a devout Confederate. Suffice to say, I believe it is reasonable to postulate they are on comparable levels of depravity, inhumanity, cruelty and criminality. However, from my standpoint as an American citizen and resident of the U.S. I must say that my personal loathing for the CSA exceeds that of Nazi Germany. Every day of my life and every day of all or our lives in the U.S. we still deal with the legacy of racism and hatred represented in the white supremacist dehumanization of African phenotypes which the Confederacy fought to preserve.

    In sum: I am no racist, and I am certainly no supporter of the CSA nor apologist for the CSA.

    However, I find that your decision to, "ban" as some have said, products which bear imagery resembling the CSA flag is nearly as upsetting and worrisome as the original ideology that you apparently fear is promoted by such imagery. In truth, I suspect that your decision to take these actions represents little more than a calculated effort to jump on a bandwagon of political correct hysteria that is sweeping the nation, in the wake of the racial tensions, race-baiting and promotion of racial-hatred that has largely been fanned by race-baiting, extremist voices in in American society.

    In the first place, the idea that your banning of these items is actually a meaningful act is absurd. In the second place, by taking this action you have set a precedent and opened a door to potentially far more injurious breaches of free speech, education and openness.

    If all representations of the CSA flag are to be considered "too offensive" to risk your carrying products that bear such imagery, then what about products which may bear such imagery even though they contain no substantive support for and perhaps even criticism of the CSA and its ideals?

    There are many products which might fit into this category, including books, computer game, and even clothing, flags or memorabilia. Does an image of the Confederate flag necessarily constitute "support" for the CSA or its ideals? In banning all such representations from your product line, you have in effect stated such a policy. The implications of such mindless self-censorship are chilling to consider.

    “Huckleberry Finn” is arguably one of the most anti-racist books in American history. Nonetheless during the early 20th century it was banned from many libraries simply because it included the derogatory form of the word “negro;” simpleminded reactionaries who could not be bothered to actually read and understand the book took the inclusion of that single word in the book as sufficient sign that the book supported or promoted racism.

    “Django Unchained," is a recent hit movie set in the pre-Civil War south which is unquestionably anti-racist and anti-CSA. If any of the advertising or packaging of this movie include a CSA flag, that would, according to the logic of your blanket self-censorship, constitute an unacceptable risk of promoting racism and hatred. Were you to ban a work like “Django Unchained” simply because it included a CSA flag, you would in fact be guilty of undermining a product with a strongly anti-racist and anti-CSA message. The absurdity of your actions is that, by banning all products that bear the CSA flag, you are at risk of undermining education, as well as judicious commentary, much less worthwhile critiques of the racism and hatred of the CSA itself. You are of course, not obliged to sell products which you deem to be offensive. But by declaring that any product that bears a CSA flag IS offensive you have committed the very sort of bigotry and intolerance that you are presumably intending not to promote through your self-censorship.

    I support your concern about not contributing to racism or hatred. But I strongly denounce you blanket self-censorship for failing to actually do anything meaningful to act on that concern and for setting a precedent that is likely to promote racism and hatred. By removing all products that bear the CSA flag, you may feel you have acted conscientiously, or at least fashionable in terms of the bandwagon of self-censorship that is sweeping the nation in the wake of the Charleston Massacre. But in fact, with a blanket self-censorship of any product bearing the CSA flag you acted irresponsibly and irrationally. I would ask that you and your legal staff, step back, think hard and reassess your decision to ban all products bearing the CSA flag.

    In spite of my loathing of the CSA, as long as you maintain your current policy, which I deem to be censorship, I will make a point of avoiding doing business with you. Moreover, I will communicate my thoughts on the matter widely and encourage others to act as they see fit.

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