Scourge of War Boards

Changing the artillery battery facing (Although I do see good puffs of smoke from your guns) and selecting infantry only from battery CO, might of made a difference.

ADukes wrote:

Maybe you should finally switch to solid ammo instead of firing shells.

I have a better idea... I will switch to cannister and push the artillery in the front line.

Anyway, here's the results of this late and final (I guess) test. There are a few notes to be said about this test. The first one is that knowing I could not control O'Neal, I totally disregarded the safety of my infantry because I knew I would have to disregard the Union guns statistics as well.

The map is full of troops so the test was focused solely on my CSA artillery whose range was always around 500yds (some of the guns at around 400yds). My infantry was always behind my guns so as not to hinder the LOS.

I also believe I documented a very strange behaviour on behalf of one Union gun in particular that perhaps should be looked upon. At some point, the Union starts to come on my left side and one of my BDEs is exposed on its right flank because I turn it to face it so that it doesn't come close to cannister range.

Be advised bombing started at 14.10' and carried on until the end of the scenario which happened at 14.50' so this is about 40' of barrage. I let the AI handle ammunition and targets of course. Goal is to see how lethal the Arty really is without cannister and draw an average ***global***of efficiency according to the shoot/kill ratio, keeping in mind the AI will use Shrapnel first, Shell next and Solid in the end.

Here's the detailed breakdown. Deployment first, final statistics next.




Reese's guns carry 48 12 48 12 EACH. That's 120x4=480 ammo where 48 are out of range (Cannister) so that makes 432 total usable ammo for his battery.

At the end of the scenario, Reese shows as having 134 unexpended ammo which are actually 86 when cannister is subtracted. This means Reese's boys globally shot 346 rounds and his total kills are 35.
Total shot/hit ratio is --> 9,88






Fry has the same ammo "configuration" which is 48 12 48 12 EACH: 432 usable ammo for his battery just like Reese.
At the end of the scenario, Fry shows as having 173 unexpended ammo which become 125 once the 48 of cannister are subtracted. Fry has shot 259 rounds causing 27 casualties. More or less that's the same kill ratio as Reese.
Total shot/hit ratio is ---> 9,59



Page has a different ammo configuration: 48 18 42 12. The figures are the same on the total ammo available which is 480-48= 432.
At the end of the scenario, Page has 148 unused ammo - 48 cannister means 100 unexpended and usable. So, out of 432, Page's battery shot 332 rounds causing 4 total casualties on the Union.
Total shot/hit ratio is ---> 83
(I don't understand if you are really reading this but it means it takes EIGHTYTHREE shots to kill just 1 enemy soldier)




Carter's battery has the same ammo configuration as Page: 48 18 42 12. Same maths again, 120 shots per gun, 480 total shots - 12x4=48 cannister. So, Carter starts with 480-48= 432 usable rounds.
At the end of the scenario, Carter's battery appears to have 212 unused rounds. 212-48=164. Carter's battery has shot 432-164= 268 rounds killing 9 troopers.
Total shot/hit ratio is ---> 29.7



I took this SS to make you see what it is McPherson's ridge when all my 16 guns are shooting at it at the same time. Be advised this is at REGULAR 1x speed.



At some point, during the barrage, I noticed that one of the Union guns arrived to my positions. I don't know how this happened but the gun was there and the limber at the objective. This gun shot and actually routed one of my guns but it didn't appear to be "present" because as you see there seems to be no target at such a close distance. To be honest I am not sure this gun really routed mine because I think the gun is actually at its limber. I can't understand why the AI moved this gun so close and I don't know if it used cannister to rout my gun so I guess something very strange happened here.



As already noted elsewhere (not by me) there's times when the routed gun shows the sprites of the horse and the limbered gun separated.



This is the end of the scenario, SS taken BEFORE the calculation screens. As you can see 16 guns could not cause any real damage to the Union camped at the objective. I am not entirely sure the camped BDE is fully in display, there may be more troops hiding behind but out of sight (hw settings show 700 yds at max), still, a concentration of units where you can see 3 RGT and 4guns remained with the final concentration unscathed with the exception of 2 Union guns which were routed.

The overall statistics displayed by this quick test show a total of 346+259+332+268= 1205 shots fired for a total of 75 kills.

The global shot/kill ratio is 1205/75 = 16,06 for Rodes' Division.
It means it takes 16 artillery shots to kill a single soldier.

I can't but look at these data in an analytic way and pray I miscalculated and I would really be happy if I had.

I hope you guys credit me with using my time to help solving a problem rather than thinking bad of me because that Karma thing is going down down down... and I am a bit sad about it.

When I see a post like the one above, I know it took a lot of time and effort to do, and it's not for a selfish cause. It's hard to post subjects that may be unpopular to others, most of us live in a democratic society that allows "Free Speech", I respect what others have say like it or not, personal attacks is another thing. I for one will give credit where credit is due, and I like to see someone put up a good fight for what they think is right.

You'all have a good day; BOSTON

Excellent summation, GShock! I admire those who the ability to detail their discussions! Well done!

J

Good test, GShock. You've shown that there is no area effect in the hit calculation. If you have the time and inclination, perhaps you could repeat the Rhodes scenario with solid shot as per ADukes suggestion. The results should give a smaller ratio since the 'fuse inefficiency' won't be present. It will also tells us what value the game uses for the 'fuse inefficiency'.

Is your point that confederate artillery is ineffective or artillery in general? Artillery is going to be the biggest contention this game has. Here are 2 examples of artillery fire:
1) As Burnside’s column lumbered up, Confederate pieces began blasting away with fire that Potter described as brisk. The Federals stopped and formed a battle line in the woods. Colonel Zenas R. Bliss, commanding one of Potters’s brigades, recalled in his unpublished memoirs that as Burnside and his “numerous staff and orderlies” moved up, they were greeted by a volley of artillery shells. “The first one struck in front of us about twenty yards and rolled on the ground and did not explode,” remembered Bliss. “The second passed directly over my head and struck the ground about the same distance in rear of me, doing no damage whatsoever. In a few seconds another came over the woods and striking near Burnside’s staff knocked the dust and dirt on many of them.”

Here we see three direct hits with failed fuses. Maybe the South could have gotten unlucky and killed Burnside.

2) “Our men who were not wounded or killed fired 80 rounds of cartridges that morning,” one of Pegram’s soldiers wrote in his diary, “and we were constantly handing them the guns of the killed and wounded so theirs could cool off. And we also lost a great many men – more by the explosion of shells which were constantly bursting over our heads and falling behind our works, as the Yankees by this time had the range down fine.”

Here we see Union artillery effectiveness.

Of course, you can push your artillery up to canister range, the game allows this as there is no negative effect done to the guns (as increased casualties from rifle fire). Of course in actual battles guns were never pushed that far ahead. Artillery, sharpshooters, and other small arms fire would have made this dangerous for the gunners. At Sayler’s Creek the union noticed that the rebs had few if any artillery and did push their guns up close. (anyone may correct me if I am wrong)

History doesn't take into account many of the things we must take. Weather, Range, Experience, Terrain, Tgt Type. Unfortunately such historical data cannot be used to assess the value of opposed artilleries even if by just a rough estimate.

As I said already, I start from logics, not from history and I keep asking myself this question:

Who, in his sane state of mind, would order an attack of any type against a dug-in force of 70.000+ with an artillery capable of hitting one man every 16 shots?

I do not think Lee was senile, therefore, it is absolutely impossible that the confederate artillery worked like this.

Marching Thru Georgia wrote:

Good test, GShock. You've shown that there is no area effect in the hit calculation. If you have the time and inclination, perhaps you could repeat the Rhodes scenario with solid shot as per ADukes suggestion. The results should give a smaller ratio since the 'fuse inefficiency' won't be present. It will also tells us what value the game uses for the 'fuse inefficiency'.

This is why we have the best community there is!

The SDK will be out VERY soon, so you can read the values and change them. We're almost there! Jim just through it all back on my plate Which is only fair since he's been killing himself trying to get the manual written. We would not be able to release for months if we had to finish it, but we'll get it out and give you what we have. None of the guys on the team can wait to see what you all do with this!

Good to hear norb. Just wait til after next Wednesday please!

I have one question. Once mods are allowed in multiplayer, if all players do not have exactly the same mods activated in game, what happens? Do they just activate what the host has and fail to connect if they don't have some of the mods, or?