My Gui has got to go

[NY Cavalry]

I hate it, hate it, hate it.

[voltigeur]

Your arguments are well presented, I'm sure nsd will be considering your request in earnest. :cheer:

[Skyhigh]

This is a good time to ask: what is this MyGui thing exactly?

I haven't been involved in the earlier games of NSD and I have seen a lot of anti-love on this forum for MyGui.
What is it, why is it good and/or bad?

[sifis172]

GUI-general user interface. it's the way all the buttons, commands, formations etc.
are placed for the user to use. i don't know why it's said to be bad tho.

[con20or]

This is a good time to ask: what is this MyGui thing exactly?

I haven't been involved in the earlier games of NSD and I have seen a lot of anti-love on this forum for MyGui.
What is it, why is it good and/or bad?

We use MyGUI to design the menus, in-game interface, etc. It is a powerful tool, but took us quite alot of time to learn so you are seeing the feedback from modders who miss the old system. I freely admit that the layout editor is a bit rough around the edges and can be quite frustrating at times. We found it a steep learning curve about this time last year when we were in the dev phase but we built a whole game with it.

Unfortunately for the OP, MyGUI cannot 'go'. I never like saying 'no, no chance', but in this case it is almost certainly true. The game is built around it and I cannot see a way for you to ever mod Waterloo without using the current SDK, sorry.

[Saddletank]

you are seeing the feedback from modders who miss the old system.

No, this isn't what most complaints are about.

The problems people raise on the forums about MyGUI are that it:

1) Makes modding harder than Gettysburg. Even simple tasks like writing a new OOB are harder!

2) In some areas limits what you can mod and how you can mod it (e.g. toolbars) over what was possible in GB.

3) Makes some of the gameplay formats downright frustrating, especially couriers in Multi-Player. HITS below 10yds height is impossible whereas it was possible at 2yds (aka first person) in Gettysburg.

4) Several weird, counter-intuitive and frustrating game functions regarding menu options when couriers are in use. For example if you bring up the main options screen (the one where you exit or save your game) and an AI courier arrives, his message panel opens and CLOSES THE MAIN MENU SCREEN. This is just bad interface design.

My view is that if MyGUI isn't replaced by another GUI interface tool that is more user friendly and flexible the modding capability of WL will be quite seriously limited, as will it's life.

The interface in Gettysburg was simply better in every respect except possibly the slickness of how it looked and even then MyGUI isn't that much of an improvement.

If WL is going to be developed into a long-running franchise like Gettysburg was, with other battles, then MyGUI really does "have to go", even if it means a patch that is effectively a re-issue of the game.

[con20or]

you are seeing the feedback from modders who miss the old system.

No, this isn't what most complaints are about.

The problems people raise on the forums about MyGUI are that it:

1) Makes modding harder than Gettysburg. Even simple tasks like writing a new OOB are harder!

2) In some areas limits what you can mod and how you can mod it (e.g. toolbars) over what was possible in GB.

Are you sure - the top half of your list sounds like modders missing the old system to me!

4 is a new one to me, but in fairness how much of the game do you spend with your save-menu open and why would you want to!?! The other closing windows issues we are looking at for the patch as I have already told you.

The game won't be redesigned, sorry.

[Saddletank]

You call it "us missing the old system". We call it "the new system does not work as well". That is, its not a good choice for an SOW game as it lacks the ability to be used for what players want. It lacks the ability to even deliver one of the games core features - MP courier play - without giving a player hypertension. That seems a pretty critical design error to me.

If #4 is a new one on you that merely highlights how little testing the team did on the new game. I found it about a week into owning the game. Whether its a thing a player comes across often or not is not the point, its the fact it exists at all that is the concern! Its clear you never played a longish MP game using courier messages between players or else no way would you have released it.

[NY Cavalry]

The point of the original post is to give feedback.

If the new system is considered a big advancement please do not think this way. If a player does like it better then the old system the next question is by what mark. Is it a big improvement or is it a slight improvement? I doubt that the 'improvement' was worth making a considerable portion of your base dissatisfied.

Another point of the original post was to show that the developers in any new games, like a SOW Gettysburg 2, needs to use the old system. Your fan base should increase by 5x because of Napoleonics, but lets hope that an improved engine for a SOW Gettysburg 2 game will use the old system.

We have all seen this before with big names such as Matrix (where commercial interest come first) start making suggestions because they are the experts. In my opinion give me the small independent game developer. Norbsoft needs to call the shots not Matrix.

So, it is screw your base or produce games that keep us buying. It is your choice not mine. If your attitude is we have sales so no forget you.......again that is your choice.

[con20or]

Guys,

MyGUi cannot go.

I can't comment on the justification for a UI upgrade and have no explanation for why we missed obscure HITS bugs. Hopefully a recent review of SOWWL will demonstrate why we made it less daunting:

"Compared to previous Scourge of War games though, Waterloo is the most user friendly having undergone a UI redesign."